Why the Same Struggles Keep Repeating in Your Family | Generational Strongholds

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Why do the same fears, addictions, conflicts, and unhealthy patterns keep appearing throughout a family? You may deeply love Jesus and still feel trapped by something you can't seem to overcome.

Charity and Tania explain how generational strongholds take root, how they differ from ordinary habits, and why inherited family patterns can feel like part of your identity. Tania also shares her personal journey of finding freedom from a deeply rooted stronghold of fear.

Through Scripture and honest conversation, they explore deliverance, healing, breaking agreement with lies, and the difference between spiritual oppression and possession. You'll discover how to invite the Holy Spirit into these wounded places and pursue lasting freedom without fear, shame, or condemnation.

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THE BOOK: Intentional Breakthrough by Charity Gurtler
https://a.co/d/08wOsvMY

Intentional breakthrough is possible when we align ourselves with God’s love and truth. You don’t have to sit and wait for your breakthrough to happen. Healing and restoration are attainable. Begin your journey today.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

And what happens with these generational things, these generational dysfunctions, is you're born into them. We all were. We all were. Um you're born into different things that are not perfectly healthy, like a culture of shame, a culture of fear. And it's so easy to take them on because number one, it was normalized in your family, and number two, you weren't given the tools to actually navigate it in a healthy way. So it was kind of like a slam dunk, you know. It was gonna start to you're gonna start to adopt those behaviors and and and those that stronghold really, and it gets a place in you. But it's not irreversible. It's not. I've been hearing about a lot of people just this idea is starting to come to them. Like, gosh, I think there's generational things in my family passing down and kind of just a new topic and exploring how to even go after that. Um, so let's start. What is a stronghold, Tanya, and what's a generational stronghold?

SPEAKER_00 1:05

Yeah. So we we do have the difference between I'll start with strongholds because this is kind of the gist, and then define what a generational stronghold looks like. Um, but a stronghold is more than just like a bad habit. It is something that you just can't seem to get ground over. Something that seems to the one thing that popped in my head, and I'm just gonna put it out there, um, sometimes, and this is a struggle that's prevalent with men, but also we're seeing a greater prevalence with women struggling with pornography. Um, so somebody who's like, I know it's bad, I know it's hurting me, I know it's not healthy for me or in my relationship, but I can't seem to put it down. Or addiction. Um, I know smoking is bad, I know drinking is bad, and and I just can't seem to put it down. So a stronghold is something that has uh like a uh a hold on you that is more than just a bad habit. Um, like I can have a bad habit and just be like, you know what, bite biting my nails. I used to bite my nails really bad when I was younger. And at one point I was like, you know what? I just don't want to do this anymore. I don't want to bite my nails. I want to let them grow. Um, and it was really hard, but it but I was able to get over that bad habit. That's so that's not like a stronghold. Right.

SPEAKER_02 2:19

Well, honestly, I would say that bad habit was probably just a symptom of potentially a deeper stronghold of anxiety or fear or whatever else. But yeah, that was just a symptom of what you're going through.

SPEAKER_00 2:30

I love that because you're right. So another stronghold is fear. If you seem to be fearful of something, and it's not just like, oh, I'm afraid of heights, or you know, I uh I had an experience with a stronghold of fear that was tormenting me. So a stronghold is something that you find torment over that you seem to be oppressed by that has some level of authority over you. Okay. Now, generational strongholds, a little little difference is you can identify a gener generational stronghold with a pattern throughout um generations. So when people are talking to me and they say, Yeah, you know, my my dad struggles with alcoholism, and so did his dad, and so did his mom, it's like, okay, now we see a generational stronghold of addiction or alcoholism throughout the family. Or uh sometimes judgment is another big one. So we can have a spirit of judgment, a stronghold of judgment where we find ourselves judgmental towards other people. But then when you talk to someone and they're like, yeah, well, all the women in our family seem to be very judgmental. We all have very strong opinions. Now we're talking about generational strongholds. So a little bit different. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 3:42

That's great, Tanya. Thank you. Um, in that book, Intentional Breakthrough, uh I just wonder the definition on there is a stronghold is a position fortified and defended for security or survival. In a battle, it's a place controlled by a side where they can set up camp and launch launch attacks on nearby areas. Strongholds can exist in our thoughts, feelings, actions, and therefore our lives. They can be held by the enemy or by Christ. So it's almost like this area that's just gotten fortified over time for something specific. It could be good or bad. There could be a stronghold of joy in our life, which would be is wonderful, but there could be a stronghold of fear. And it's almost like a stronghold, like from that place, that it gets held within our heart, and from that place the enemy attacks and tries to expand and grow. And it's like we got to get right at the stronghold at the root of that before we can, before we can move forward. Yeah. In 2 Corinthians 10, 4, um, in the Bible it says, for the weapons are of our warfare are not of the flesh, but have divine power to destroy strongholds. So that talks about those spiritual weapons. We can destroy strongholds in our lives and in our families' life, in our the family line. So okay, so how have you seen them? Talk more a little bit about how you've seen them express. Um, so if you're if someone comes to you for counseling and what would they be saying or doing that would pinpoint you to be like, oh, we're dealing with like with a generational stronghold.

SPEAKER_00 5:08

Okay, I'm gonna give you a real life example that happened to me where I was able to identify I had a stronghold of fear. Um, and I if I have to think really hard about it, it I mean, fear is one of those that's pretty broad that most families are gonna deal with that. But for me, like I'll give you the symptoms that I was able to say, oh, okay, this is a stronghold of fear. Um, I would have, ever since I was a child, I was afraid of the dark. Okay, but it was it was beyond just being afraid of the dark. It lasted well into adulthood. Probably like until until I was delivered from a spirit of fear. Um, I was afraid of the dark. I would not get up in the middle of the night to use the bathroom because I didn't like it to be dark in the house. I didn't like it to be dark down the hallway. And then like I felt like there was always something there in the hallway staring at me. I would have nightmares all the time. Um, but it was it was controlling me even control. So you listen to the language. It was controlling me. So I was fearful of our finances. Um, we went through like 20, 2009, like that whole economy thing was was a bad time for a lot of people. But I was very fearful of our finances, even though we were very secure where we are now. Um, I was fearful of my for my children, like what if something happens to them? So it was controlling my life and behavior. So again, hear the language, controlling. It was something negative that was controlling me. And so yeah, it was but that was a lot of the symptoms, is just fear of everything.

SPEAKER_02 6:37

So would you say talked about those thoughts that can come into our head and recognizing wait, those are lies. But would you say like the thoughts were coming in and you couldn't even recognize them as lies? It just felt like truth and you couldn't even stop yourself from believing them.

SPEAKER_00 6:50

That's kind of what you would say define controlling as? I would say that there are different layers of that fear. So the financial fear, yes, was more of a lie that was coming through. So that I could identify it as a lie. And so there was a a trigger that happened, you know, when in 2009, um, the economy crashed, my husband lost his job. Like it was just a very financially difficult time for us. So that is a trigger that was connected to a lie. So then the lie is, well, we got to be careful because it it could happen again. And of course, like it can't happen again. But it but it was controlling like watch our spending, make sure we have plenty of savings. Um, so things like that. So that is more of a of a smaller fear, like byproduct. The strong that was a lie. That was connected to a lie. That this God's not protecting you or God won't give you the finances you he's not providing his daily bread. That's the lie.

SPEAKER_01 7:47

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 7:47

The stronghold is more of it was something that's not even a thought. It is just a natural state of being, of being fearful, nightmares, afraid of the dark, um, afraid of you know, like movies and stuff. I mean, all uh it was more of it. The only way I can describe it, it was so ingrained, because what I'm seeing right now is like roots deep into my core that it was a part of me. That's a stronghold. So there's a difference between the lie piece and the stronghold, right? Yeah. So, but it's all connected in some way because that root of fear that was part of my core, being a fearful person now affects my relationships in all different areas. So was this a generational stronghold? I am thinking, yeah, it has to be. Uh because if I look back at my family, yeah, absolutely. Like my siblings, I believe, are still struggling with that. It's still kind of a root in there, uh, which would stem from my mom. Yeah, yeah. I so I can see it in different parts of my family.

SPEAKER_02 8:54

Yeah. I work with people very often um with different things, and most things actually are. Most things are passed down. And like we talked about in the last episode, many times unknowingly by our parents, they tried their best. It was passed down. And, you know, hopefully they passed it down in a better, you know, play than what they received, and sometimes they didn't. But but yeah, it's almost everything tends to be passed down. And what happens with these generational things, these generational dysfunctions is you're born into them. We all were, we all were. Um, you're born into different things that are not perfectly healthy, like a culture of shame, a culture of fear. And you just as a baby, child, you know, young adult, you take these things. It's so easy to take them on because number one, it was normalized in your family. And number two, you weren't given the tools to actually navigate it in a healthy way. So it was kind of like a slam dunk, you know, it was gonna start to, you're gonna start to adopt those behaviors and and and those that stronghold, really. And it gets a place in you. But it's not irreversible. It's not. So talk about your journey to get free. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 9:56

You know, the the crazy thing is there were two moments, two defining moments where I really saw. And so a little bit of this too is like we've got to understand neuroscience, um, neural pathways in the brain. Like our brain is like plasticity, and it's proven that over time you can reinforce certain thoughts and behaviors by by coming to agreement with it over and over, habits that we do over and over. The beauty of that is that it can change because we can actually change our neuropathways by making a cognitive decision to stop. So there is there are strongholds and then there's habits that reinforce those strongholds. So, my experience, I was, I was actually at a deliverance ministry in Phoenix that was a little uh, what's the word I'm looking for? Traumatic is the best way that I could describe it. And so I was there because I was supporting somebody else. And then someone just came, you know, to talk to me and they're like, oh, I'm gonna pray over you. And they started praying over me. And I literally felt, and I say literally, like I felt something that was almost like grabbing my rib cage from the inside and it was being pulled out. And and she said it was a spirit of fear. And I I felt this spirit like being ripped out of me. And I know that sounds that again, we're talking about the supernatural. Okay, this is the experience that I had. Um, and there was such a relief that came from that. So that so it was traumatic because it was a traumatic experience, and I felt um not well supported during that process, like after the the deliverance, there was a lot of things.

SPEAKER_02 11:32

There wasn't a lot of explanation, there wasn't a lot of gentleness, there wasn't a lot of like loving you as the person for who you are. It was just sort of like a come in and bah, what just happened, sort of a thing.

SPEAKER_00 11:41

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But but there was there was freedom that came with that because I think I do I I have experienced it before deliverance can be effective, but it can also be traumatic to the the person. And we we have the care of souls, like the care of the individual. We want to make sure not only that they're delivered, but that they remain free from bondage. So that deliverance did happen. There was still a layer of this fear though. So when that happened, the nightmare stops. Yeah, go ahead. No, that's what I was gonna ask. What happened after that? So after the nightmare stops, the tour, I'm not afraid of the dark anymore. Just like, I don't know, it's like a light switch. Nothing. It's just it's weird to explain. I'm not afraid of the dark. I get up in the middle of the night, I can look down the hallway, I'm not afraid. This this sense of fear, I mean, there was this covering of fear that was over me. So that did relief. However, I had another aha moment experience that was tied to the spirit of fear that was frustrating because I'm like, this spirit is I'm relieved of it, but I'm still, I would, I would have um moments where I would was asked to speak at certain different events, like public speaking, uh, on a topic that I was very confident in. And also I've had people say, like, you're really good at doing this, like it's really you really should do this. I would say yes to speaking engagements. And then as I was coming up to that event, anxiety would overwhelm me to the point that I would almost make myself sick. I was like, I don't want to do this. How do I get at it? Like it's awful. And I was sharing it. This is where wise discernment came in, because I was sharing it with a really good friend of mine at the time, and she looked at me and she said, That's a spirit of fear. And I was like, Oh my gosh. And then she was like, I rebuke that spirit of fear, you know, in the name of Jesus, like over me. And I was so angry because I'm like, that that enemy, he still had me. And I was still coming into agreement with that spirit of fear when she spoke that over me, like it just severed. Uh, and then and then of course I still don't particularly like doing speaking and engagements, it's not my favorite, but I'll do it. But the fear, the anxiety piece of it was gone. So that was my two experiences with like actually being delivered from, I believe, the stronghold. And then the other piece was like there was there was just something still lingering that had to be released from. And then it was changing the neuropathways.

SPEAKER_02 13:56

So why do you okay? No, keep going.

SPEAKER_00 13:59

It's like changing the neuropathways. Yeah. Yeah, there has to be a piece of it too where I had to stop agreeing with the lie, you know, that's like, oh, you're gonna be anxious, you're gonna be nervous, like yeah, you know, why do you do this? Like, why do you agree to these things when you don't really like to do it? You know, it's so I had to break that neuro, I had to create a new neuropathway. Only say yes to the those who are truly passionate. Yes. So you say the lies still. Yeah, so because it's it's like you said in the last episode, is like, yes, we know unforgiveness is is the the planting the seeds, the lies is like watering these seeds to plant this root, this stronghold. The the stronghold is the root. I'm such a visual person, so that's how I'm that's now how I'm envisioning it. Yeah, but yeah, so I had to break the lies.

SPEAKER_02 14:46

Yeah, so how would you explain to people that you had to get delivered twice? Why? Why not just once?

SPEAKER_00 14:54

I think I asked you this once, and one of the best explanations that you've said to me is the garden. It's it's that there are different parts of your garden. So the root comes in and it's like an infection, and so it spreads this infection to different parts of the garden, right? And so when we pull up the root, so we take that splinter out of the ground or out of sometimes. I I do the analogy is like you've got a thorn under your skin. Uh, and if you put ointment on the top, like you haven't really taken that thorn out. So you take the thorn out that is pulling up the stronghold, and then you have to work on the lies. Well, what lies were left behind? Or like different parts of the garden that you have to work on because it it infected other parts of the garden. Maybe not as strong because it wasn't as strong. As soon as my friend called it out and I realized what it was, I was like, oh my gosh, the enemy's getting at me again. I said a couple curse words to him. No, that's it.

SPEAKER_02 15:51

That's what I say too. It's just it's that understanding that we we have parts, we have parts of us. Like there's a part of me that feels confident in this situation, but oh, but then there's a part of me that feels afraid. And it's understanding that and and that the fact that the Lord brings healing to each of those parts. So it's like each little section of the garden, you know. And so we go through one area and find that cultivated and get that healed, but now there's another part over here, and and it could pop up, you know, different things could pop up in different places. And so it's just following his lead. There's no way any of us could figure this out. It's literally like, Holy Spirit, where are we going today? Lead me today, uh, where you would like to heal. And he does, and he does a great job healing through that.

SPEAKER_00 16:29

So let me ask you a question. Um, because there are some schools of thoughts. And again, you know, we're we're talking about the supernatural here. So we don't have everything, we only know what scripture tells us to go by, you know, word for word. Everything outside of that, it's like these are just schools of thoughts. So one school of thought, and this is where I'm like kind of thinking what I was dealing with, like stage fright could be a part of, anyways. The school of thought is we have a strong man or the strong man. Have you heard this language before? The strong man? Yeah. Okay. So fear would be the strong man. So think of it like a general, like we're talking about like an army of the the enemy, and so the general is fear, and then he's got soldiers underneath of him. And so I I feel like breaking that strong man of fear, pulling that out, is what then exposed this uh, you know, stage fright, whatever it is, like whatever that's gonna be.

SPEAKER_02 17:28

Yeah, the little things that were still the little root tendrils that still were scattered throughout, but like it was much different than because that the the head was gone, basically.

SPEAKER_00 17:37

Yes, exactly. What do you think about that? So with when we talk about that language of like the strong man.

SPEAKER_02 17:43

Yeah, I I've never necessarily used strongman in in those terms, but I can see how that would fit. It um that definitely fits. I see that a lot walking people through deliverance and healing, um, freedom is yeah, there's like that one big initial big breakthrough, but it doesn't mean that particular stronghold isn't gonna show up in other parts and areas of their life. But every time we come up against it, it's less and less and less and until one day it's gone, you know. But yeah, there is that usually that big initial break. But after that big initial break, it's like the person's so much more free to think clearly in those areas. So yeah, like but you were aware of the stage fright, but that was like a a situation-specific thing. It was like this happens just when this was, it wasn't like an all-consuming all the time type of thing.

SPEAKER_00 18:31

Right. And there is so we go to scripture, we can look at like the language of the strongman. So I think it's uh Mark, it's Mark chapter three, verse 27. It says, But no one can enter a strong man's house and plunder his goods unless he first binds the strongman, and indeed he may plunder his house. So I I wonder too if that because that language is in scripture, if that's so that's why I've heard the word strongman used before. And so it's like you've got to bind, so in a way you bind the strongman or you pull that root out, right? And then that's when you can go through and get the the the rest of the army and attack them.

SPEAKER_02 19:06

Let's yeah, it makes a lot of sense. Let's talk a little bit about because you talked about this deliverance experience being traumatic. Um, and we love to walk people through it in a lot much more gentle way. So, what does that look like?

SPEAKER_00 19:18

Like uh guided prayer sessions versus a deliverance. Yeah. Um I I have seen so that and again, this is I think it is preference and I think it is tools, and I think it is a base in knowledge. And so I do want to just state from the get-go that I have seen deliverance be very effective. I've experienced it myself. I've I've walked other people through it, I've seen it be very effective. What happens sometimes is I feel like it can go a little faster than the body is ready for, or like the emotional state of the individual is ready for. Um, while it's effective. So there is also scripture where you know Jesus warns like if you you cast out these seven demons and then you sweep your household nice and clean, but if you don't fill it with the spirit, in essence, what it's saying, if you don't fill it with the Holy Spirit, then it can come back and it'll bring, or you've cast one out and it'll bring seven more back, that's even worse than the before. So I have seen um that you cast out, you know, a strong man, for example, stronghold or you know, generational spirit. And then if the person is just not emotionally or spiritually mature enough to recognize the schemes of the enemy, it can come back. Uh and so with the guided prayer sessions, the reason that I I find it more effective, as it is longer, okay, it does take more time, but it's at the pace of the individual because we let the Holy Spirit lead. And so what the spirit will reveal what the we don't know, you and I don't know. You know, as humans, we don't know what the individual's ready for. And I do, I'll be honest, I get impatient sometimes. I'm like, just get that thing out. But if they're not ready, the spirit's gonna lead you slower. And it's and yeah, there's gonna be layers. It's like an archaeology dig.

SPEAKER_02 21:04

We gotta dig nice and slow, gentle, gentle. Yeah, but it leaves the person in a much better place and it leaves them connected to the Lord. I think that's why I'm passionate about that too, is because we're not just stepping in, doing some work and leaving, and the person's like, what just happened? Where's the Lord? How do I find him? How do I, what's even going on? It's like we're coming and just and it's realizing that that stronghold's there because it's a root, it's a root that's connected. So we cut all those ties of that root. It naturally leaves. Like it just the healing happens. And that person, though, has developed a history and a journey with the Lord in that process. Usually we meet with people in about an hour and a half, and there's a the walk with the Lord is deepened during that time because they're connected to Him the whole time. And it's just so gentle and it's filled with His love and His truth. And they leave not only free, but they leave connected to the Lord and having built their foundation in the history with the Lord. And that's the goal is that they leave connected to. Ham because I have too. I've seen um I've seen some really really sad endings when people do get delivered and aren't able to maintain it. And so that's not every time, but but I love being able to walk people through it and it's like a of course they're gonna be able to maintain it because it was the healing happened with the deliverance. It wasn't just deliverance, it was deliverance and healing. When healing takes place, deliverance naturally occurs, it just naturally happens. Okay, so I talked back in episode three, I think, about my experience with spiritual warfare and realizing like this dark thing left me, right? And then last week's episode, I talked about the forgiveness the Lord had brought me through this bank blank sheet of paper, and I just forgave like dozens and dozens of people. And then a few months later, I had that phone call with someone where um we walked through all these lies and broke them and replaced them with the truth. And it was only like very shortly after that that I had that instance where there's this dark thing. I told it to leave and it left. But that's why it was so easy because all the root tendrils had been cut, all the forgiveness, the Lord had walked me through that, all the breaking of the lies, replacing with the truth. And then it came down to that moment and God said, Tell that thing to go, and I told it to go and it left. And it was easy because I'd walk He had walked me through all of the healing that needed to happen. Does that make sense? And I didn't put that in the water until years later. Yeah. So I was healed though, and I stayed healed, and it wasn't hard to stay healed because I was healed. I was free. I was free and I stayed free, but it wasn't hard to stay free because I was healed.

unknown 23:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:33

So the healing takes place when you do it this way. But it does take a little bit longer. Yes.

SPEAKER_00 23:38

And and that's not to discredit, again, it's not to discredit other methods or that other methods aren't effective because I again I have experienced it can be effective. It's the um, we talked about another episode. There's a time and a place to both, maybe. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:55

There could be a time and a place to both.

SPEAKER_00 23:57

Yeah. We talked about the ongoing process. So so this is two where I find it can be discouraging for people because again, the weeds come back in your garden. If you're not constantly, if if anybody has, and I know we live in Arizona, so we don't garden outside, but in Virginia, when I did garden outside, there was there would weeds come up? If you don't tend to the garden, the weeds are gonna come back. So I think what the struggles sometimes to, again, about the carousels for the individual, is that somebody walks through deliverance and they rebuke the spirit of fear, they rebuke this spirit, all these oppressive spirits that have been controlling and and dominating their lives and oppressing them. And then what happens when six months later, a year later, two years later, now they're feeling this oppression come back and they're like, oh gosh, well, what happened? It didn't work, or or what did I do wrong, or I backslid, or it's like, no, it's like spiritual maturity is an ongoing process of forgiveness, recognizing this. Yeah, because listen, the devil is crafty, he's been doing this way longer than any of us have ever been in alive. And so if he can't get you through one stronghold, trust me, he's gonna try another. He's gonna be like, pull my beer.

SPEAKER_02 25:07

Yes. But here's what I learned he gets in through the cracks, say the cracks in the armor. So we can ask the Lord, God, where is this crack in my armor? Where is this dent in the shield? Can we can you lead me to healing in this area? And he does. And I'm telling you, those arrows that used to shoot through the shield and hit the opening in the shield and like get you. When we take that time and ask the Lord, let's heal this part of the shield, they come and they just bounce right off and you don't even feel it. You're like, oh, yeah. I used to be afraid in this situation. I don't even feel fear anymore. It's like I used to be afraid, and then I was aware of fear, and then I was like, okay, fear go, but it was still kind of there. It was a struggle. And then when the healing was in that area was completed, I don't even feel it. I just feel his joy and I feel his expectancy. I feel faith instead, like naturally feel faith. Faith is evidence. Faith isn't something we rev up on our own. Faith is evidence. It comes from the encounter with the Lord, the healing. So yeah, that just happened. I just uh worked with somebody and it ended up going pretty long. Um, it wasn't typically the session is about an hour and a half, but there's just a lot we need to work through. And there was, there was deliverance, there was freedom, and there was real change. And they even told me, they're like, I am forever changed. I am forever changed. But then they said, you know what? But can we meet again? Because there's more. There's yeah, I'm still noticing there's more. I noticed the freedom in this area, but then this area, there's still something more. And I was like, okay, yeah, let's go after this part. Like there's there's these parts, and we will constantly be working through these parts. When we're going through a crisis, like a lot of parts all at once, but we can get to that place where, okay, all right, this part of my garden of my heart is cultivated. Okay, God, let's go after this one now. And it gets to a more of a peaceful place. But when you're just getting started, I'd give this analogy all the time. It feels like a jungle. Like when I just was getting started with this, it felt like a jungle, and I'm chopping trees and I'm pulling up roots and I'm pulling down vines and doing all this work. And I step back and I'm like, it's still a jungle. Like I can hardly even tell I did any work. We just keep going with the Holy Spirit, and He just does all this healing, all of this work inside of you. And at this point today, I can say, like, I live in this cultivated garden, and it's just peaceful, and there's still stuff to deal with, but I have the tools. I know how to deal with it and how to, you know, clear this area, but I live in this peaceful place. Um, we have to close that, but I have a quick question for you. I know that there's some people that are gonna be like, okay, I am dealing with a generational stronghold. There's gonna be a lot of people who are like, yeah, I feel I mean, I'm fine. Like, yeah, I struggle with fear. I struggle, you know, sometimes I'm afraid. Sometimes me and my spouse argue. I don't really know why stuff comes up, but I that can't be like a stronghold, is it?

SPEAKER_00 27:38

What would you say? Well, I want to, I I want to make sure we're very clear that stronghold is not a measurement of your faith or your relationship with Christ. Okay, so some people are are would hear stronghold and they would get offended, which offends.

unknown 27:54

Right.

SPEAKER_00 27:54

If you're offended by something, like, you know, look, find out why you're offended. So some people are like, oh no, I don't, I'm a Christian. I'm a baptized believer. I don't have any strongholds. On this side of eternity, the enemy is going to constantly try to attack us and go after us, get through us through our family, our our children, our spouses, our friends, our relationships. On this side of eternity, every single Christian believer will be tormented to some degree or another. I I think it's just a reality of it because the enemy has some level of influence from a stronghold. Is that what you're saying? Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. And some more degrees than others. Um, you know, like sometimes I I just I hear Christians be like, well, no, Christians can't be oppressed. Now there is a difference. I don't know if we talked about this before. There is a difference between possession and oppression. Okay. Oppression is just influence, like you said. I love that word. Um, we're not possessed because our spirit belongs to Christ. What do you think?

SPEAKER_02 28:53

But you did use the word control. Like you were that spirit of fear was controlling you. Yeah. Is that different than possession? Absolutely.

SPEAKER_00 29:00

Because uh well, I think that our our thoughts of like what The Exorcist or all those other, which I don't watch those movies anymore because I can't because they terrify me, which is a reason why I don't watch them. But those types of movies will kind of um, you know, like your body, your head is spinning around and you're vomiting, and you're like your body is like climbing the walls and stuff. That is a different level of like that's possession where a spirit can actually control your body. Let's go back to scripture. So the man, um, when Jesus crossed the sea, and then he was on the other side, and there was that man that was cutting himself with rocks and he had the lesion in him. Yeah, he was possessed by legions of demonic entities, and so Jesus actually cast those demons into a horde of pigs that then killed themselves, right? So that is like possession when controlling oppression is more of like something that is controlling your behavior, and I say controlling not in a sense of like greatly influencing, yeah, greatly influencing. It's not like a puppet master where like the you know, the stronghold is like, oh, I'm gonna make you do this. But this is the way to describe it is like the oppression is so heavy that the enemy can whisper something to you in your ear because that's what happens, and then you react to it and you act on it. So there's levels of influence, but yeah, I go ahead. Well, I was thinking people, yeah, back to like my my fear, the one that I had. Um, I here is like a perfect example. I would wake up in the middle of the night and like, oh, I have to go use the bathroom. And so that's my first thought. And then immediately be like, there's something under the bed, there's something in the closet, something's gonna grab you outside of the bathroom, something is down the hallway. That's the oppression that the enemy is planting thoughts in my mind that then controls my behavior. Now I'm like, well, I'm gonna hold it till the morning. What time is it? Okay, it's only four o'clock. I can wait two more hours. That's the I have come into agreement with those lies. So the control, that's my behavior.

SPEAKER_02 31:00

Does that make sense? Yeah, yeah. I think just the word control makes people think of possession, but that's not what you're trying to say. It's like greatly influencing to the point where it's affecting your behavior and affecting the decisions that you make. And there is levels of that. There's and especially when people start finding freedom, it's really hard to break free, but then they start getting to that place where they're aware of it, but maybe still can't like change their behavior, but then they start to maybe make decisions that are against it, and then they start to break free of it. Yeah. And so people are can be anywhere in that spectrum. Um, but just if something is influencing, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:35

Well, one one more just example of what happened, like after this deliverance of the spirit of fear. It wasn't like immediately I woke up and then like everything was fine. I also did have to constantly remind myself of God's truth. So there were times now, it was greatly different. It was before where it felt like it was on my body and all over me, the spirit of fear. Now it's like it was on the outside trying to get in. Like you said, it would throw little darts like and hit and hit the armor. Yeah. And so there were a few times that I would wake up and I would feel this presence. And I was like, okay, Lord, I know you're greater. I know you're stronger. If there is something here that's trying to make me afraid, like, Lord, I I know that you are here, you protect me, you love me, that your power is greater than anything that's trying to oppress me right now. And I would say that out loud. And then I would boldly say, you know what? I'm not going to come into agreement with that spirit of fear. And I would get up out of that and I would force myself to use the bathroom just to not be controlled by that fear. So I know we're running, we're running over our time, but you got me going. You gotta stop, but we'll just finish.

SPEAKER_02 32:39

We're gonna have to do this next time. Okay. Ephesians 6 13. Having done all but stand, stand firm. So you did the all, broke the fear, broke the strongman, broke the lies, found the truth, and then there was that moment where you had to stand firm and then finally gave up and it was gone. That is that's a really common pattern. Okay, we gotta close up, but we're gonna have to get into this again because I think you have a lot more to say. So next time we'll just keep going. All right, thanks for tuning in. If you want more information, anchored biblical counseling.org, intentional breakthrough.com. If you have any questions, put it in the comments. We love answering questions. So, okay, until next time. See you next time.